Washington Votes Forum

Introduced in the House on January 10, 2007

Click here to view bill details.

This bill is another attempt at forcing fit parents to adhere to a judges interpretation of how their children should be raised. Why do we need this intrusion in our lives? Relationships cannot be legislated. This goes against fundamental Constitutional Rights. Our Constitutionally protected rights to the care, custody and control of our children are being compromised and hashed around in court when we have done nothing wrong. The same legislators try this year after year. For "Special Interest" groups. How come they don't understand that it's a parents job to decide whom their children will associate with? Would these same legislators try to make a bill that would allow parents to sue grandparents whom don't want to see their grandchildren? Wouldn't that be Equal Protection? I bet they wouldn't try that kind of bill, now would they? A minor child's best interest is served by loving, protective parents. Parents in general are NOT opposed to their children seeing their grandparents who respect the parents. This would include the majority of grandparents. Parents are opposed to government involvement when there is a difference of opinion between the parents and nonparent relatives - grandparents - over the parent's children. The children in these cases are happy and healthy, their parents loving and protective. Courts should not be substituting their opinion for that of the fit parents decision. Since this is not a life or death issue, it should stay out of the legal system. Grandparents who are thinking of taking parents to court may want to think about alternate solutions to solving their family conflicts, like say, being decent human beings! Grandparents who sue for visitation obviously are opposed to allowing their adult children the same right they enjoyed raising their own children without government interference. This is NOT about the children, it's about manipulative, vindictive, controlling, narcissist grandparents, whom are allowed legal harassment through the courts. This is in turn Family Abuse that is legislated. Grandparents who sue demonstrate precisely why they are not welcomed to be a part of the grandchildren's lives. A grandparent who takes advantage of a single parent's situation and sues because they can does NOT serve anyone's interest but their own. This is a Baby-Boomer control issue, not a rights issue. Taking healthy families to court, at tremendous expense to the family, further degrading them with psychological evaluations, violating their privacy with attorneys and judges is abuse of the family. Normal, rational grandparents don't use these laws or need them. Normal grandparents value parents and the relationship between themselves and the child's parents and don't find it necessary to further damage the relationship with hateful court actions where the child is caught in the middle. If a family relationship has deteriorated to the point that you would need court intervention to visit your grandchild, then it's time to walk away. These cases are like a never ending divorce, it isn't healthy for the child at all. Litigation brings tremendous stress to the child, and whole family. Is it in the best interest of the child/children to bankrupt parents by suing them and depriving their children of activities and, possible necessities of life? Obviously, something has changed if a parent decides that the grandparents are no longer welcome in their home, or be allowed to visit with the grandchildren. These are Obviously NOT fit grandparents, and it's up to the parents to make that determination. There is normally a legitimate reason a parent would stop a grandparent from seeing the child. The type of Harm that comes from litigation definately supersedes any kind of "So Called" Harm that the grandparents claim that the children receive in not seeing them. May I ask what happens when a grandparent dies, or doesn't want to see their grandchildren? Nothing, the children are still loved by their parents, and they move on. There is NO HARM PERIOD! FIT parents should not have to defend their right to parent, and protect their children from third parties. Bad parents age and become bad grandparents. Parents shouldn't have to defend their right to limit contact with people they know to be harmful. Grandparent visitation ONLY affects FIT parents. When a parent is unfit then grandparent visitation will NOT help the child, and there are other laws in place. These grandparents should be ashamed for using the court system to assault family privacy. Grandparent visitation is a priviledge not a right. This goes against the caselaw of the WA State Supreme Court, Appelate Court, and the US Supreme Court Decision in Troxel, as well as against the US Constitution, and WA State Constitution. This Bill pays lip service to the caselaw. There are NOT ENOUGH protections for Fit Parents. This is Bad Law.

I don't want to take custody of my grandson I would like to at least see him once in awhile. My grandson is just now 1 years old I have gotten to see him 1 time. Just because my sons girlfriend left him for another man we are not allowed to see him. My sons pays his child support every month and is still not allowed to see his son. That is all in court. As for my husband and I we would just like to visit our grandson as often as we could, but as of right now we will never be able to visit him or get to know him or anything else. How is that fair ? How is my wanting to visit him trying to take him away from her. I think that someone worded this bill wrong. Visitation is not custody.

you are absolutly correct, I put an harrasment order on my daughters Grandparents and in return they filed for full custody of my child. Now it is going on two years of harrasement through litigation. How is this possible? The Grandparents are manuplitive and nasty. They have told my daughter awful things about me and still the judge has not thrown it out of court. I do not have a lot of money to spend fighting them and they know this of course through discovery of everything I have. I feel as though they are raping me of my rights as a parent.

I have had my grandson in my home every week for 2 years, 2 to 3 days a week and never a problem. Now we have said no to lending money. He is no longer allowed to talk with us, we can no longer see him, and to go to their house to see him we must call first...but the kids won't answer the phone. If we found the money to lend them, then the problem would be solved. Not all grandparents are bad some are being held hostage by the children they raised.

I really sympathize with you on this one. Saying you are held hostage buy the kids you raised is putting the hurt mildly. We too, have been blamed for every bad decision our son has made and every thing we did not give into during the time we raised him. He has grown tall and straight even so. He found his wife's parents to be more to his liking (they spoil him sinfully and because they have no male children, they have treated him like their own). For that we are greatful however, now that he has a psuedo set of parents, unfortunately, we are expendable. When our Granddaughter was born, from that point forward she was used as a tool in leveraging his wants against us. When we did not give in and buy him whaever he thought he needed at the time, we were outcast and not included in the family, we went for three years without even being allowed to send her a birthday or Christmas gift...all were returned spitefully. Then suddenly, he was faced with a possible divorce and financial dire-straits and reached out to us. We, of course, let our love over-rule our hurt feelings and took him/them back open arms, paid most of the oppressive bills they had and helped in other ways to set them back on the path to success. Then, after they had worked out their issues both marital and financial, the leveraging started anew. We couldn't afford to buy them a new washer and dryer set to replace the ones that broke, so the parents in law rode in to the rescue and now, we are back to square one. We have not seen them nor have we been allowed to even send a card. We have been again spurned. Talk about crushing hurt. From what we have been told from our granddaughter herself, in a chance meeting at a public childrens play center where we had taken our other two grandchildren, we were told that she (our granddaughter-now 4) would see us when she was 16 and would not be allowed to see us before then. Then, without even a sideways glance at us, our son scolded her for talking to us and hustled her away. We have longed for some way to press for grandparental visitation rights but then again, should the courts finally allow it again, I doubt we would press for it anymore. As grandparents, we feel it is far more important for our granddaughter to have a strong family relationship with her parents rather than have to be dragged like a tug of war rope between two factions at odds with each other. What we are doing now is banking on the fact that someday, as usually happens with adopted kids and those separated from one or the other parent by divorce, that someday she will seek us out. We have therefore been accumulating and storing all the cards, small gifts, and other treasures and things grandparents save for their granchildren, in a storage box for her. We will be at her graduation and any other public event where our son and wife cannot restrict us from being. Any sports event she choses to partake in etc, she will know we were there cheering her on. When that time comes and she seeks us out and is ready to know and absorb facts in a better mindset than as a small child, she will know that it was not by our choice that we didn't see her and that even though not allowed, our love for her was/is no less. Sorry for being so long winded but we thought you might take solice in that you are not alone and perhaps can take action in a like way, to salvage the love of your grandchildren when they finally throw off the shackles of oppression inflicted by immature and self-centered parents. Take care and may God grant you strength and peace.